I want proof that the cat really sh*ts the beans!

[Steve]

£129

[Ian]

Otherwise I see the same things coming as with goose liver.
(Where the animals get the food shot down their throat to get a sick liver soon)

Creepy.

Yeah, foie gras, that is pretty sick - along with veal crates etc.

[Tonka]

Ever heard of chon? Its a vietnamese coffee that is reputedly made by feeding the beans to a special breed of weasel that consumes them (whole, presumably!) then shits them out for roasting by the farmer. I've tried it... not sure about the weasel story, but the coffee was pretty rich

[Joey]

I can say that the a*se story has sold over 80kg of £128 a kg coffee, and has raised my profile to being talked about on BBC radio program and printed in the trade press. It has also intorduced some people to my coffee that would never have heard of me otherwise and are now regular customers who do pay for good coffee as well as one with a story.

I have to back this up with I would never buy farmed luwak and have been told that the one I have isnt from the this source I do have some morals

Wow, that's good news. Makes me rethink again. So I will ask my roaster where he gets it from. When we can't trust, and if I would just like to try 3kg first instead of a hole bag (or I guess they sell it only in small amounts anyway) - would you sell me some greens, too?

Joey

[mattmills]

Im sorry but i find this really hard to get into.
From the sales side Joey im all for it, if people are nieve enough then go all out for it, it is crazy.

It is this sort of thing that is really damaging for the speciality coffee market. We already have a probelm where people are creating a story for the sake of the story, when you are buying a coffee now you have to talk about the story behind it, which has got to the point where it is becoming a joke.

The story behind a coffee has a point but i believe we need to be careful with this, otherwise we will lose the reasoning behind it.

Ok off soap box now.... sorry

[Joey]

matt, that's x-actly why I started this thread. It was/is hard to believe for me, too.

As you are speaking "creating a story for the sake of the story".... are there any other coffees where the stories behind it are maybe not true?
Or did I misunderstand the sentence "we already have a problem where people are....." ?

Sorry, but lately it happens to me that I can interpret posts both ways, so I better ask before I misunderstand it..... wish English would be my native language >sigh<

joey

[Steve]

I disagree Matt I think anything that riases the conversation of specialty coffee is a good thing, even if it is a strange story, its one that has caught people attention. It like the starbucks thing it introduces them and then lets them realize theres a good thing going on here

<also steps of his soap box>

Steve

[mattmills]

Joey, nearly every coffee that is around at the moment has a story, im not debating whether they are true or not, where the probelm (i believe) is that sometimes the story is there purely to sell the coffee. Any coffee from the around the world can be turned round with a story. Much of it started by trying to get extra money whilst prices were low. Every farm has a stroy, so does every exporter.

Steve, i get the point on that and agree, but we seem or are starting to get to the point where the best coffees are not recognised for thier profile but the story.

It is almost to the point when you are scourcing the coffee you are sourcing the story as well and it si this that i fearful of.

This point of Cat Sh*t coffee is a perfect example... it is a speciality coffee not for the taste but for the story (whether it is true or not) and this is where i am worried about speciality coffee, as there is the risk of losing the credibility, and just being a marketing ploy.

[Gouezeri]

Ok, first off, I agree with Steve (but let's hope he doesn't notice )
Now, as for stories selling coffee. It seems to me that this is often when the stories have something to do with how the coffee is treated, i.e. monsoon malabars, washed coffees, or beans that have been through the digestive tract of a cat! There's nothing wrong with these stories as long as at the end of the day we're judging the quality of the coffee that we drink and not the yarn. I don't care where it has been or what has been done to it, as long as it tastes good.
I'll get down off my civet now
Dom

[phil]

I'll get down off my civet now

Surely that's illegal?

[Gouezeri]

It's ok, it's stuffed (coffee beans mainly)

[Steve]

I suppose the same is with the Fair Trade stuff that the story that a farmer got a slightly better price means it doesnt matter what the coffee tastes like, but thats a topic best left

[Gouezeri]

Very true though Steve. I unfortunately know people who drink freeze dried FT coffee.... it tastes like, well, anything but coffee, but they are happy believing in the story they have paid for. At which point PaulT and I will probably start quoting Barthes :
" Nous voguons sans cesse entre l'objet et sa démystification, impuissant à rendre sa totalité: car si nous pénétrons l'objet, nous le libérons mais nous le détruisons; et si nous lui laissons son poids, nous le respectons, mais nous le restituons encore mystifié." (RB, "Mythologies" 1970)

[mattmills]

Steve.... definately best left alone that one hahahha can and worms spring to mind

[Joey]

Joey, nearly every coffee that is around at the moment has a story, im not debating whether they are true or not, where the probelm (i believe) is that sometimes the story is there purely to sell the coffee. Any coffee from the around the world can be turned round with a story. Much of it started by trying to get extra money whilst prices were low. Every farm has a stroy, so does every exporter.

I don't see a products (real) story as a problem. Every wine or whiskey or cigar can have a story, too.
I think a BMW lover doesn't buy the BMW only because it's a technically perfect instrument. Successful branding programs are based on the concept of singularity.
The ordinary person, wheeling a shopping cart trough the aisle of a supermarket, is in touch with her deepest emotions - everything is sold with feelings.
Of course there is a rational thinking, too. And there we have the car example again:
BMW - a mobile status symbol (emotional) and a high quality engineered car (rational). But again – why does the Mercedes driver not buy a Fiat?

It's trying to find a meaningful difference that will set your product apart within its category.
The whole Specialtiy Coffee theme is a story of it's own, trying to tell people that it's better then mass production harvest.

I love telling people that it's a pitty that most farms in Yemen are growing raisins now instead of coffee because they make more money with it. And therefore my Yemen matari is something special because it's not so easy to get as others. Makes it interesting and people are happy to have tasted something not everybody has. Or the monsooned story of the Indian....
Don't we all try to tell everybody that Speciality Coffee is something "special"? We need these stories to make the people believe it is.

I started this thread because I want to know if I am telling the truth about the Kopi. Because as Steve said you need to trust your source - I also only want to tell stories that are true. But if they are true, they are very important to understand and most important to connect (as a customer) with the product.

speech over