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Roasters and roasting

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Postby zix » Sun Dec 04, 2011 12:02 am

Oh, and I can't wait either. To be honest, mostly I don't want to, I can't really understand why you would withhold yourself from the fresh-from-the-roaster experience in home roasting. It tastes like nothing else. I guess people who make wine do the same thing with their first flush or whatever it is called.
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Postby bruceb » Sun Dec 04, 2011 10:40 am

Richard wrote:How much stock of greens do you people hold ?


I always have between 30 and 50 kg of various beans on hand. I use that much in a year, but I don't drink it all myself. At the moment I have about 20kg Brazilian and Colombian, 15 kg central American (Costa Rica, Guatemala, El Salvador, Mexico) and about 8kg Indonesian and Ethiopian beans. I store them in jute or paper bags in a dark cabinet in a cool room. In my experience properly stored beans will last a long time, although others with more discerning palates say they lose character after a couple of years.

As to waiting before using the beans, if you drink espresso you will hardly enjoy a cup made from freshly (< less than 2 days after roasting) roasted beans. If the beans have not degassed properly the CO2 causes the coffee to foam during extraction and it tastes very acidic and astringent. This generally does not apply to other methods of brewing.
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Postby CakeBoy » Sun Dec 04, 2011 9:52 pm

That is a mighty stash Bruce! :)
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Postby motoman » Thu Dec 15, 2011 1:32 pm

zix wrote:Oh, and I can't wait either. To be honest, mostly I don't want to, I can't really understand why you would withhold yourself from the fresh-from-the-roaster experience in home roasting. It tastes like nothing else. I guess people who make wine do the same thing with their first flush or whatever it is called.


I do not usually flush mine until after I have drunk it, different country, different customs.
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Postby RobC » Thu Dec 15, 2011 11:25 pm

lol motoman.

I'm quite keen on using fresh roasted in a Cafetiere, as for espresso as BruceB states fresh roasted produces enormous crema but it dissipates very quickly - I'm not adverse to trying a shot of fresh just once though to compare - and each origin tends to have it's own particular rest period - it's just a matter of working out how many days after roasting produces the best taste.
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Postby zix » Wed Aug 15, 2012 10:28 pm

Baahaha, motoman, funny!
Saw the joke at last - well, the regulars here (those old enough) already know I'm slow. I now must add "absent" to my vices. Slow and absent, how's that for a caffeine addict...
Anyway, yes, I know about the crema vanishing fast, CO2 spritz, lacking in body, ne pas comme il faut thing with not waiting min. 2 days, but honestly, I enjoy those first shots anyway. It's a thing, I guess... And it is fun to try and guess how it will taste next day.
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Postby bruceb » Thu Aug 16, 2012 5:23 am

Well, I am no fan of freshly roasted in the espresso machine, but I won't have any choice this evening. I only have enough roasted beans for my morning hit so I'm going to have to crank up the Maggio. I do have some very nice Costa Rica beans waiting to be roasted.
Three Francesconi (CMA) espresso machines - Rossi, San Marco, LaCimbali, Faema and 2 Mazzer Major grinders- CoffeeTech Maggionlino, Hottop, Alpenröst and HW Precision roasters.
I decided I needed a bit of a change so I roasted some Monsooned Malabar. That was a change!
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Postby motoman » Fri Sep 28, 2012 8:46 am

I recently ran out of roasted beans and made a drink from fresh roasted beans. It was not coffee as we know it, but a surprisingly mild and easy drink to swallow. Unfortunately drinking marsh mellow for breakfast is not something I wish to repeat on a daily basis. I urge anyone who has never tried this to have a go, you will soon learn to avoid cafes that advertise freshly roasted beans.
In my case I drank tea for a couple of days in order to let the roast rest. What I should have done was make a drink every day to see how long it took to degausse and mature.

I love the smell of freshly burned chaff in the morning.
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Postby bruceb » Fri Sep 28, 2012 7:27 pm

Invariably I forget to roast in time and I am then forced to drink coffee from freshly roasted beans. As Moto said it's not the same as a regular cup, but it's still thousands of times better than I can get in any local café or restaurant. I usually make a single 60 ml with fresh beans because half of that is foam. When it settles the shot is very tasty and I usually have it in a cappuccino. Most beans settle down after 3 days. I should note, however, that I roast relatively dark = well into second crack, but no oil on the surface. IMO lighter beans <Full City are not suitable for espresso when fresh.
Three Francesconi (CMA) espresso machines - Rossi, San Marco, LaCimbali, Faema and 2 Mazzer Major grinders- CoffeeTech Maggionlino, Hottop, Alpenröst and HW Precision roasters.
I decided I needed a bit of a change so I roasted some Monsooned Malabar. That was a change!
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Postby CakeBoy » Sun Sep 30, 2012 11:03 am

I remember the early days and not being able to wait to try fresh beans. Some of Steve's blends would produce huge amounts of crema when they were under three days old. Delicious, happy memories :)
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Postby zix » Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:00 am

Just a quick update. The settings are so un-intuitive for me on the Behmor. I keep forgetting what each button does, and when I remember, the next thing that happens is I get lost trying to figure out how to tweak the roast settings to my liking... so here are a few notes.

This is for espresso roasts.
Firstly, I am not happy with the first and second cracks merging. So I choose the P2 profile. Secondly, I want to be able to reach second crack when I roast - even though I may not always go there. (yeah, right... ;))
Quick guide: 1lb, D, P2.
(grid voltage is 240, and this is what I set it for. I used to play around with this setting, but stopped)
300-400g depending on hardness of bean.

The trick to getting it to second crack is simply using less coffee than the designated weight. P2 is because this calms the roast down a bit so first and second crack won't merge.

I watch the roast. From the sound of first crack it's full attention. If needed, I open the hatch between 1st and 2nd to calm things down. I prefer at least a minute or two of silence from the beans at this stage.

.
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Postby GreenBean » Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:09 pm

zix wrote:Just a quick update. The settings are so un-intuitive for me on the Behmor. I keep forgetting what each button does, and when I remember, the next thing that happens is I get lost trying to figure out how to tweak the roast settings to my liking... so here are a few notes......

It is regrettable that concerns about product liability and the desire to make things foolproof result in products that are difficult and frustrating to use. It is good to hear that you have found ways to make it work :D Are you happy with the results?
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Postby zix » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:36 am

It is less troublesome now - as long as I sit in the same room (it is now used in my kitchen at home instead of at work, as was originally intended), it is pretty much trouble-free, and yes, it does give me good roasting results. And it is a comparably clean machine, AND I can roast 300-350g comfortably. More than with the heat gun, about the same amount as in the oven but the roast is more even.

The best roasts I have ever done are still the ones with the hot air gun + bowl. Sorry, Joe! But I like it dark, not charcoal, but I want to be able to get into 2nd crack. I knew from the start that it would be harder on this one, the way it is set up. And it may be the right choice, for safety's sake, even though Behmor is obviously perfectly capable of doing darker roasts. Just not quite the right choice for me...
Last edited by zix on Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:47 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Postby zix » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:44 am

Should have mentioned in my second to last post (now the third to last...) that I also press the + time button to get the max roasting time at D (around 21 minutes if I recall correctly). This means I usually have some 5-8 minutes roast time left when the beans have stopped 1st crack, not 1-3 minutes as is usually the case when I put the designated weight in.
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Postby zix » Mon Oct 29, 2012 12:55 am

P.S. (oh dear, here we go, fourth-to last, that was a pointless reference): there is a very small but also very interesting little electronic effect control waiting for me in the tool shop. Sutronics made it, and it works by switching on and off current for a 1 second period. If more effect is to be applied, it simply lets the current through for a longer part of the second. It is good for some 2kW I think, and for a capable electronics guy it should be easy to decouple the heat programming and switch over to this manual control. The catch being that it would be nice to retain the cooling program... We'll see, I'd need to find a willing/interested logic electronics solder gun slinger first.
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