Should I get a Gene?

[toast21]

Oi-Oi credibility risk coming-on, using the 'Gene' roaster are you ? Think I may have to save for the HT then if you regard Macs as "poofy-white-stuff" that doesn't need any muscle (Or anti virus) to keep it working.

Hey, you'll note i didn't say anything about macs being p**fy or white... although it IS interesting that you raised it yourself hehehe

seriously though, congrats on the step closer to getting a roaster

[Richard]

seriously though, congrats on the step closer to getting a roaster

"Poofy-white-stuff" is a title given by a light-hearted adversary on the only other internet forum I use, as time goes by I realise why it's poofy.

You don't need to be technically advanced to keep your system going and it rarely breaks down.

On to coffee

I've actually taken a step backwards away from the 'Gene' roaster because of my success with a wok, after a little practice I realised the quantity in the pan was quite important, to little and the roasted beans roast to quickly and unevenly, to many beans and it's just uneven.

With the pan and lid I'm using I use 150 grams of beans and don't lift the lid until after first crack, another 2 minutes gets me signs of 2-nd and I dump. Recently it's all nice and even but it is easy to make it uneven.

Ok, off-topic and should have been on the relevant thread but it sort of ties with my early experience and my want to go a little more efficient. Fact-is, it's less messy because you keep the lid on for longer and the smoke stays in, does this affect the flavour ?

Maybe it does, the Kenya Blue Mountain has a lovely smoky flavour.

[toast21]

Richard I've been thinking about this as well... is your wok a thick based cast iron one? I think they'd work alot better than the thinner aluminium type jobs.

[Richard]

No, my wok is what I would describe as middle-range hard anodised-non-stick, I think as important as the pan or wok is having a lid.

My first few roasts were very uneven and I think that was because the contact between the beans and the pan was doing to much roasting rather than a combination of accumulated heat within the pan/lid and contact.

Question is, if you get a very heavy pan it wont loose it's heat quick enough when you decide you need to back-off for 10 seconds. I'm not convinced that a heavier pan or wok would help because it still only took 7-ish minutes to get to first crack and once the heat had built-up within I was using a combination of taking the lid off, reducing the heat and more vigorous shaking just to slow-down the roast.

The retained heat benefit that a heavy pan gives you may not be a blessing at all.

Do you have a heavy pan ? I know what's going to happen, you'll end-up with arms like Poppeye the Sailor and go for a lighter one.

So, to reiterate the benefits.
Good chaff and smoke control.
Very good heat control. (I am using a propane hob, no gas this far west)
150 gram roasts. (I'm trying 200 next time)

Don't leave the wok on the hob and stir with a wooden spoon, it's not as good as shaking and swirling continually, for you sedentary guys with no arm muscle, do some press-ups.

[toast21]

Do you have a heavy pan ? I know what's going to happen, you'll end-up with arms like Poppeye the Sailor and go for a lighter one.

nah, i only ever used the WP and then got my gene. Now that i've got the gene, i couldn't imagine using my wok.

You're probably right with regards to the thick pased woks.. i know with the gene, I sometimes need to change heat immediately which wouldn't happen with a thick base.

End of the day though, as long as you're happy with what you've got, keep doing it i say!

[Richard]

End of the day though, as long as you're happy with what you've got, keep doing it i say!

To be perfectly honest I would buy a Gene roaster and probably will once I've recovered from my latest spending spree and the cost of winter fuel that has to be paid for 'up-front' rather than after you've used it, wood, oil, propane and solid fuel to the tune of £6/700, ouch.

Now that I have the taste for nice home roasted, ground and brewed coffee and the early excitement of discovery has subsided a little the roasting process needs to be as efficient as possible, it's the drinking and tasting I'm interested in.

In the meantime I'm going to try to perfect this pan-roasting so at least I can contribute to this forum and the on-going thread this subject should be posted on. (Sorry Steve)

How long has the Gene been in production ? presumably it's an import from the USA. The fact that spares are easily available is comforting, what else, if anything, is a consumable on this machine other than the heater element ?

[toast21]

gene's actually Korean and been available for quite a while although there seems to be a VERY distinct issue with gene's shipped PRE March 2007. The 2 big distributors in the UK (HasBean and Bella Barista) both have the new ones, so you're fine there.

as for consumable parts, there's the little rubber stopper that is attached to the little chaff sweeper inside the roasting chamber. You know about the heating element but it'll prolly last you a couple of years. If you're roasting indoors and without much airflow, you might want to look at getting the bigger chaff collector. It has an outlet at the top so that you can whack a pipe on there and lead the pipe out the window so no more smoke

[Sarion]

I did it! Today, I went over to Lieren and bought a Gene from the people of Ongebrand.nl! 335 euros, not a bad price. And they gave me 2 kilos of greens of my choice for 10 euros extra. Great deal, I think!

So I got home this evening, and unpacked my new baby. Put in 250 grams of beans and fired it up! I had it set too high (don`t follow the advice in the manual), so I had to set it to cooling after 16.3 minutes, 2.7 before I would have cooled down automatically. But I achieved a very nice roast, I think. Full City + probably.

Also I found a very nice shared roasting log on another site. Very hot/cool application! Just Google it sometime, there are 100 roasts online already.

Thank you all very much for your great advice! I very much appreciated it. I will let you know how happy I am with my new Gene!

Now to update my profile...

[CakeBoy]

Excellent ... a good deal too!

[zapty]

Congratulations, Berend. Looks like you are going to have some fun testing it out.

[dadioles]

I am very happy indeed with my Cafe Gene.

I do not have anything to compare it with and have never used Hotop but suspect that the slightly negative experiences people quote about the Gene may be a little out of date now as it has gone through a few minor improvements since the first releases.

The heating element in particular is now better suited to the voltages of the countries it is supplied to and should last a long time (cheap and easy to replace if required) mine is rated at 240v (UK).

A couple of spare (tiny) rubber bumper stops, for the flappy bit that clears chaff from the exit were supplied with my machine (in a plastic bag pinned to the instruction manual) but I think they too will last quite a while. The manual is well produced and clear but decide upon your own temperatures and timings.

Temperature and time are adjustable throughout the roast, a really nice feel to the controls.

The chaff collector (standard) works brilliantly and I have not found smoke to be too much of an issue, empty the chaff after each roast. I roast in the kitchen and just put Gene on a wooden bread board on the cooker (to give it a level platform) with the cooker hood extracting gently on its minimum setting (it vents to outside the building). Having the kitchen window open slightly helps with airflow but other than positioning the Gene exhaust centrally under the cooker hood I do not add supplementary baffles or anything. It just is not a significant issue.

Watching the roast is quite hypnotic, I cannot imagine a clearer view of beans roasting absolutely effortlessly and evenly as the drum rotates. I found a good light essential and use a bright torch to really light up the beans and see what the colour is like.

I cannot understand what all the fuss is about "slow cooling" but possibly my palate is not sophisticated enough to detect the nuances of taste in subtly different roasts. The automatic cooling cycle and rate of cooling seems perfectly adequate.

My technique is to watch the roast and look for the points when chaff comes off in large quantities and then hit the button to start the cooling cycle, about 30 secs early, as the beans carry on roasting for a short while in the residual heat. The initial temperature drop is quite rapid and I expect that once the beans have cooled by about 40 deg c or more they will not change much. After a little under 10 minutes in the cooling cycle it is down to 60 deg c and the machine beeps then switches off. The beans are now just warm to the touch so I tip them out onto a tray to finish cooling before storing.

I do tend to roast quite dark and am still experimenting (does that ever stop?!!) with varieties, temperatures and times.

Listening for the "crack" takes a bit of practice and I still find it quite hard, looking for chaff being stripped off gives a good clue as to what is happening as it build up at the exit vent of the roasting chamber. The weighted flappy bit does a good job of keeping this clear. A couple of times it has jammed with a bean or excessive chaff but frees itself after a few rotations. As I said, quite hypnotic, pull up a chair, get comfortable, shine a bright light on the beans and drink a coffee while watching. Can you do that with a Hotop?

I roast 250g at a time, a nice round number.
My starting temperature is set to 245 deg c and when that is reached (more or less) I drop this to 235 around first crack just to slow the process down a bit. Typical roasting times are around 17 to 18 mins followed by the 10 min cool down. I set the time initially for a 20 mins roast and simply press the button to start the cooling cycle when I have decided the beans are dark enough. My logic for setting 20 mins is that if "something" happens and my attention is taken away from the roaster, it will only over roast by a couple of minutes and although the beans will be very dark they should not have got to the self ignition stage!

Roasting advice is greatly appreciated, times, temperatures.

Watching the beans very carefully (this is where the torch is so useful) there comes a point where the beans go from dark brown with a dull matt surface to just starting to take on a slight shine with one or two beans just starting to exude a tiny drop of oil. At that point I start cooling.
Do you think I have gone slightly too far? I must say, the results taste pretty good.

Sorry.... gone on far too long.

Les

[Syber]

Damn Sarion...

[Sarion]

Damn Sarion...

Please excuse Syber here. We've had the coffee equivalent of a nuclear arms race going for a number of years now. While he had me out-espresso-machined and out-roastered for a while, it was now time to strike back! Take this!

[lukas]

Hm ... so one can describe upgradeitus in other words: cold coffee war?

[Cookie]

I like that phrase.

Coffee cold war.

I've just gone over to the dark side and bought a hottop but the whole Gene vs Hottop thing seems pretty evenly balanced.