Zass 175 turkish grinder - adjustable or not?

[zix]

Lifting this thread again - I bought the Zass grinder earlier today (sorry - yesterday to be exact). Couldn't resist uploading some images of it. I have only been able to test it with the VBM so far, haven't got a Brikka yet. But it works! Seems to be able to produce a coarser-than-espresso grind anyway. Will get back when I have tried it with moka pots.
Impressions so far: it is well built for its purpose - and as you may know, turkish grinders often travelled with their owners. No need for thick-walled heavy metal, and here there is none. But the burrs seem to do a good job, making a consistent grind. Taste was on par with my Minimoka (but then I need to change burrs on that).

[wang]

Cool, do tell if it works consistently enough for your VBM though.

[zix]

Wang, I have now tried the 175 with a Nicaraguan Maragogype single and a Yirg/Kenya 90/10 blend. So far I have mostly got lungos from it.

After taking it apart (you only need to loosen the two screws sitting on the outside of the grinder body, then the whole burr package can be slid out of the grinder body) and cleaning up the burrs and the inside of the grinder body I managed to make an espresso that poured as it should - around 60ml in around 25 secs. But then the setting screw was at its minimum setting, where it has pushed the burrs flush against each other.

I have never seen a classic turkish grind, but have heard that it is supposed to be even finer than the average espresso grind (if there is such a thing). If this is so, then either my Zass 175 is not quite grinding turkish, or my VBM needs finer-than-turkish to make ristrettos. The latter is not unlikely, actually, as my other grinder, the Minimoka, is usually very close to its minimum setting, with burrs touching, to make ristrettos on the VBM.

Cons: Based on my particular VBM Domobar, my Zass 175 and the beans I have tried so far, I would not use the Zass 175 as main grinder for the VBM Domobar.

Pros: As a temporary or spare grinder for espresso it would be fine though. I intend to use it mostly for moka, and expect it to work great for that - but I will get back with details when the Bialetti Brikka has arrived. The Zass does grind infinitely better than the old Krups blade grinder we previously used for moka.
A fine grind is not particularly gruelling or time-consuming to make compared to a coarse grind. It seems well built for its purpose also in this respect.

[steves]

Hmm. Intersting. I have a similar problem to you, zix, in that I want to be able to make coffee in remote places. I had also planned to solve this with a moka pot and a manual grinder, though I must say I wasn't going to go for the 175 - I was thinking of the 169 or 151 or similar. I do actually have turkish grinder which I use for pepper. I wonder how it would do... Anyway, where was I? Oh yes - what pressure are you brewing at?

[zix]

In the VBM I am brewing at 10 bar, according to the built-in meter. Only on one shot, the one after I cleaned out the grinder, did I manage to get the pressure up to those 10 bars. On the others it went to 8-9, the same thing that happens with a lungo grind made on the Minimoka.
The construction and shape of the 175 is what appeals to me for travel purposes. The old Krups blade grinder actually was fine for travelling concerning build and shape, it's just that the 175 is soooo much better concerning grind quality.

[steves]

The portability certainly appeals - but surely a turkish grind should choke your VBM? Still - should work with a moka pot - slighly coarser grind required anyway than for espresso?

[zix]

surely a turkish grind should choke your VBM?

That's what I thought too... but it doesn't seem so. Perhaps the "turkish is always finer than espresso" rule is not true with all machines? Or perhaps my grinder doesn't work as it should after all? Should I send an envelope with a bit of ground coffee to Zassenhaus and ask them if that particular grinder is off?
For the moka pot, as you say, a coarser grind is preferred - and it should work fine even with a Brikka (which is supposed to be able to take a finer grind than other moka pots), since I have been able to grind for the VBM with it. So I don't really want to give the grinder back, but it is a bit frustrating not knowing if there is something wrong with it.

[zix]

Back here with some quick observations. I am still waiting for the Brikka, but things have improved with grinding for the VBM. After cleaning the burrs and then grinding 3 or 4 batches, it seemed the grind had gotten finer. The Zass now grinds something that pours close to a ristretto on the VBM. Perhaps the burrs just needed running in? Sounds strange to me. But it is definitely better now. I must say I like the taste a lot. If it keeps grinding like this, perhaps it actually could work as a main grinder for the VBM.
I did send an email to Zassenhaus, and to the Swedish importer. So far, the Swedish guys haven't answered at all, and Zassenhaus have said that they are "very sorry that the 175 doesn't live up to my expectations" but that they don't think anything is wrong with it - as if they could know without having looked at it or the grinds (*sigh* - I didn't want to make them cry, I just wanted to know if something was wrong and, if so, what could be done about it...).

[zix]

Brikka has arrived. It is a 2-cup Brikka. The price level for Brikkas in Sweden is rather high, so I bought mine directly from bialetti.it. They have a hard-to-beat price: 23.30 € for the 2-cup model, shipping excluded.

The Brikka works fine. Differences? So far, it seems that making a good enough cup of moka coffee is a little easier wit the Brikka system than on the other moka pots. With the coffees I tried so far, the taste is generally a little less bitter. The crema is also somewhat better. (This said, I do expect to get crema from my other moka pot also, as long as the coffee is really fresh). It seems that it does indeed accept a finer grind than the common type of moka pot. The extraction is much faster, more of an on/off feeling to it. Since this is a 2-cup aluminium moka pot, warm-up time is also short. A quick way to get two single espressos, thus.

Anything in common with a common moka pot? Yes. A too fine grind will choke it. Too much heat and it will "burp", which makes the coffee go bitter and the crema disappear quickly. Concerning heat you have to be at least as careful as with a stainless steel pot, and because the extraction time is so short, you need to watch it very closely, taking it off the heat just before the crema starts oozing out.

The Zass 175 turkish mill CAN grind for the Brikka, and it does it very well so far. A good Brikka grind fineness is well within the 175's range, no problem at all. I am sure any Zass grinder would work just as well though, whether "coffee" or "espresso" grind model. The slim build of the 175 is its main advantage. If you fill the grinder to the brim with beans, it is just about enough for two Brikka fillings, provided you are careful not to let any powder go to waste. Perhaps it would be enough for one 4-cup filling too.
To sum it up, this is a very good coffee combo for the road! I am looking forward to the vacations.

[josh_robb]

Zix,

A couple of silly questions if you don't mind.

1. Where did you buy it from and how much did you pay?

2. Does it grind course enough for filter/presspot?

j.

[Panda]

I got my Zass from the UK supplier .. Haus Marketing, tel 01782 207755 (I think the Zass link/email address to them is wrong though).
The Zass website is www.zassenhaus.com .. its a great grinder if you arent doing too much and seems fine for my Bialetti moka (soon to try it with a Brikka)

[phil]

Zass grinders are also available from Another Coffee

Bialettis are available from Hasbean

Someone asked in another thread here I think.

[zix]

Sorry, I was offline for a couple of days.
josh_robb, I bought the Zass at a local tea/coffeeshop. Paid 820 SEK for it - didn't look for the best price, as it were I was happy to just find it in a shop near me.
It grinds coarse enough for vac pot and also for presso. I have tried it, not merely looked at the grinds, but only with 1 vac pot (Old Java) and 2 press pots (Old Java and a Nicaraguan Maragogype, the Old Java was very good and the Nicaraguan was strong and with lots of earthy tones). So I can't promise you that the Zass is consistent for long-time use at such a coarse grind. Moka is a bit finer, and works very well for me.
I bought the Brikka directly from bialetti.it, they have a link on their homepage to their italian webshop.