Some Tips for Me??

[phil]

Matt - the S1 price is shipped CIF UK. No further taxes other than those already included in the price. Bottom line. Obtainable from at least two TMC members too - Peter James (James Gourmet Coffee) and Steve Leighton (Hasbean). Hugh got one from Steve just the other day.

I don't know how much the price of a shipped Techno is, and it may indeed be a bit cheaper, but no where near the price difference Muko is quoting.

[HughF]

One thing about the Techno price Muko quotes is that he doesn't mention water filter and installation.
I'm assuming it needs plumbing in as http://www.justespresso.com says it has a rotary pump - doesn't it need a water filter and a permanent cold water feed installed as well?

The Techno seems to have a much bigger brew boiler than the S1 (from
http://www.chriscoffee.com/products/home/espresso/laspaziales1 ) it's 1.4L vs. 0.45 but a smaller steam boiler (1.4L vs. 2.5L for the S1). The steam temperature is also easily adjustable, not just the brew water as appears to be the case on the S1. Other than that, they look fairly similar to me.

My impression from researching a bit is that the Wega Mininova and Cimbali are both extremely solidly-built machines but both are single-boiler HX machines. Surprisingly (to me), the weight of Cimbali, Techno and S1 is pretty much the same.

I don't know anything about the Rancilio or Brasilia models.

I think your biggest decision is : is a double-boiler that important to you?

I'd prefer a rotary pump HX to a double boiler vibratory pump machine but the S1 and Techno give you both rotary pump and double boilers. I really like the idea of S1/Techno easily settable brew water temperature and total independence of steaming and brewing.

Is there Techno service available close by? I would try to avoid shipping a machine back for servicing if possible.

Cheers,

Hugh

[matts]

One thing about the Techno price Muko quotes is that he doesn't mention water filter and installation.
I'm assuming it needs plumbing in....

Is there Techno service available close by? I would try to avoid shipping a machine back for servicing if possible.

Yup, needs plumbing in but I think it comes with the water filter kit. To a poster in the US last night Rene said current price is

"1445 Euro plus transport costs (can vary from 180 to 240 Euro depending on airport location).
Customs/airport fees may add another 4%, but that doesn't always happen.
--
René van Sint Annaland
New Zealand's Human Bean"

Support might be an issue with the Techno if you're not handy yourself but I wouldn't think you'd need to be so extreme as to ship it back to France to get something fixed. IIRC it comes with a full tech manual and it's just an espresso machine after all, personally I'd do it myself...

Cheers
Matt
'is your S1 installed yet Hugh?'

[HughF]

'is your S1 installed yet Hugh?'

It will be installed tomorrow first thing, if all goes OK re the plumber. I'm on leave all day so I can get used to it once it's installed... I have 500g of ready-roasted Daterra blend (plus 2Kg green) from HB (unfortunately 8 days old due to plumbing delays, 4 days more than usual) and a pint of the Channel Island milk I only use for capuccinos.

I think I'm ready... to make my belated attempt at achieving yuppiedom!

Cheers,

Hugh

P.S. If plumbing goes well, I still won't want to say too much until I think I know it well enough not to say something I'll recant later, probably just that it's working and doing the job well.
On the good news side, my RB 53mm convex Bubinga wood/SS tamper finally arrived on Monday by Air Mail. Anyone want a 58mm convex wood/SS RB tamper in very good condition, badged Espresso Warehouse, for a reasonable price?

[robbie]

Hi all

Well as this seemed to be turning into a La Spaziale group I was keeping me head down but I'll chuck my bit in here.

I love my Techno, I would have no reason to change. It's superbly built, easy to install and configure and worked straight from the box. It just makes great coffee everytime as is pretty forgiving as far as taste is concerned with tamping variations.

There is a downside (depends on whether you need the facility or not) which is you can't steam milk and pour espresso at the same time even though it has 2 boilers. This has never been a problem so far as I can't do both at once ... I usually make the espresso for the cappuccino first (it also sort of makes sure the grind is exactly right ... oops don't tell Mrs Robbie) then follow with the milk and then make the espresso for me.

I wouldn't go for a very high end machine without spending a good amount on the grinder. The stepless mazzer is just brilliant, you can easily adjust the grind slightly during the day to compensate for temp/humidity changes. I don't have an E but the doser grinder works ok for me, obviously not quite as convenient but I still think it looks cooler standing in the kitchen than the Electronic syringe version.

I know I have been quiet of late but I don't really have any questions and with my limited knowledge of machines feel as though I can't offer much as I don't really seem to have any problems.

The only real issue with the Techno is probably service ... which you have to do yourself, well you have to do everything yourself. Personally I am happy with this arrangement but some may not like the idea of maintaining/fixing their own machines. But Rene does offer full spares should I ever need it and also ongoing email support/help/advice. Rene was very helpful with the buying process and the whole process went through very quickly and cleanly.

The full cost came in at 1859 Euro incl 19.6% vat, which included the little extras (cleaning set, 3 extra portfilter cups up to 21g, spare gasket and some other bits) and delivery. The basic machine cost was 1728 euros incl 19.6% french vat. I am not sure how this competes with the La Spaziale.

Cheers
Robbie (The one man Techno group ... but one very happy bunny)

[robbie]

Just a bit more info:
The Techno is plumbed in only but does come with a Brita water filter in the price.
Yep you can control both the steam and espresso temperatures independantly in 1 degree C steps. Brew temperature is what the Techno seems to have given priority to (and quite right too) so occasionally you may need to wait for hot water/steam but this has rarely happened with twin 1.4L boilers, certainly never for the espresso side.
Unless I am mistaken there aren't any service agents about ... but it's a coffee machine and any competant service engineer should be able to help if you can't do it yourself (at least I would hope they could).
Robbie

[phil]

So it seems as if the S1 and the Techno are actually very similarly priced (the filter is a few tens of pounds). You pays your money and you takes your choice.

I await reviews of both machines from their new owners. If you wouldn't mind writing a few words Robbie and Hugh, it's pretty obvious from this thread that there's a real need for this info. Send anything you can manage to either Raf or myself and we'll get it up onto TMC just as quickly as we can. Don't worry about layout - just some text and pictures is fine, we can do the rest.

Deal? Please?

[Muko]

Hy to all
Sorry to be away from keyboard so long but I don't have internet at home
About the grinder question,I still have a Mazzer!
And yes if I go for the Techno from Réné,I take a nice drive to the Reneka factory,because its about 150 km from Luxemburg!I am driving once a week in France and the language is also no problem because we have to learn here french german and english directlyThe price I wrote is 1500 without tax,so about 1700 within!The tax here is 15% !My fault

The problem with the price for the S1 is that the local dealer made me that written offer,composing the machine (2000 tax inc.) the filter (100 )the installation and a warranty for 1 year,the latter I think is normal,isn't it!
Luxemburg is not big so there is not much choice.Another Example,the local Reneka dealer here told me a price around 2150 euro without the filter which he is selling seperately
But otherwise I found 2500 for the cimbali was a good price(inc. installation,filter,warranty)!Or 1500 for the Mininova including the grinder 6.4 A ,the installation,the filter and warranty is also not a bad price?But here it depends on the dealers ,her they haven't a rival firm which opens a competion

marco

[HughF]

I await reviews of both machines from their new owners. If you wouldn't mind writing a few words Robbie and Hugh, it's pretty obvious from this thread that there's a real need for this info.
Deal? Please?

So long as you can wait a few weeks, I'll see what I can do about an informal review.

Update : The machine will be fitted next week, the plumber turned up but neither he nor I had the right parts.

Cheers,

Hugh

[Joey]

I vote for a Spaziale: good technology, nice deeper PF, nice people when it comes to service (met the boss in Seattle, he gave me tickets for the SIC in Milano, he recognised me there again and I talked a lot to his staff - very nice and intelligent team. Was at the Reneka booth, was not very impressive. He couldn't convince me about the Techno. But this is just my personal opinion, convinced by some not technological experiences ) Anyway, the only thing I would be afraid of at the Spaziale is that it needs more often more gaskets because of its super special body part behind the group which heats the water with the steampipe - that's what a technician told me once - but then again we were talking about using it in a Café - so I wouldn't be worried for home usage..... I don't know much about the other machines, though....
Read the manuals in the internet carefully before you decide...ask the retailers to which places they have sold one, go there and see the machines live....if possible....

joey

[moccafaux]

Why not add a hottop to your list and reduce the budget for the espresso machine a bit?
Grinder and roaster are as important as the espresso-machine!!!

[Muko]

I think for that I have still time.With my new machine and Grinder I will obtain good results I think!I know that my results will be once again better with an hopper, but 1st I'm not that professional,and 2nd my wife will kill me by now she isn't happy about the decision but till now I have the mother-in-law on my side*gg*
Well who knows
marco