SCAE and YOU!

For non-TMC members to ask questions and offer comments

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Postby scottwhite » Thu May 25, 2006 5:13 pm

what it would take is some kind of celeb to take a real interest in it and start jabbering on a few tv shows, then it would explode, Jamie Oliver for instance or someone like that.

I know that warrell thomson guy did a bit, but then consequently put his name to a machine which some would say, of course this is not neccesarily my opinion, didn't do much to convert the general public to put the jar of ground stuff in the bin.

Sorry to say that I do not believe a small organisation is going to change much, there's just not enough willing within the industry to stick together so it's not going to happen that way, it's a shame but in general, it has to be said, that's the truth Ruth. 8)
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Postby Joey » Thu May 25, 2006 7:12 pm

The SCAE and me?
For me as a shop owner the SCAE is a very good invention:
We want the same thing: Making better coffee.
Unfortunately there are so many people who teach Barista lessons.
Lavazza teaches on Lavazza machines with Lavazza recipies, Segafredo trains their own staff, and some little shop owner who doesn't even have a good machine or good coffee offers "Barista trainings" just to make some extra money.... WE WANT A EUROPEAN WIDE LEVEL OF EDUCATION.
The SCAE helps in several ways. There ARE training centers in Europe where Baristas can be trained to ONE LEVEL
But it's not only about Baristas, also about roasting, grinding, brewing....
I had the possibility to get a SCAE Trainer training in London and am now able to teach the SCAE standards and certify Baristas under their name. Of course I could have done this alone, too. And make a "Mocca Club - Certificate" - but I am not so famous yet, and the SCAE is a European wide institution. If we work together and lots of people join, the SCAE will be more famous, and I hope that in the future people will know for sure, that you only get good education if you go to the right training place and not "some guy in some shop". You can't believe how much crap I have heard in some shops here... one man is handing out certificates of a "coffee-sommelier" - but he even refuses the espresso technique! He thinks he is the pope of coffee but his methods are old, old old....
So the SCAE sets European wide standards (one has to do...it coud have been another "Club", but now it's the SCAE)
And I have to say I was very impressed how many famous companies join. When I had my training, the manager from Mahlkönig was there speaking with us about the importance of grinding. We have someone from Probat who's brain I could pick a bit, and I got to know a wonderful guy from Bunn, who changed my mind about drip coffee.
It's a pool of very interesting personalities from the coffee industry, and we as members can get any information and news.
I got a CD with all the training contents from the lessons held in Athens last year. There will be a new scientific research from Mahlkönig about how the way of cooling the beans after roasting effects the grind.... As a member I will be able to get that info...
I get cheaper materials for teaching, like posters and other things. The members themself are very helpful. I once asked for a certain coffee from Timor and immediatly got connections to a vendor who was very helpful.
It's all about contacts and connections. Sure things cost money, and I also thought 100 Euros is a lot for a one year member ship, but even the magazines I get frequently are worth it. There is so much to learn in it...
And let's not forget the Barista Championships - they help us here to get the name & job "Barista" out to the world. In Vienna not many people know what a barista is. But lately we had a huge gastronomy fair where al the gastronomers where browsing around. And exactly there we have had the Austrian CHampionship. I can tell you - this was the best place to do it.
This event was fun, loud and a big attraction. Lots of guests in the audience asked about what we are doing here and where someone can learn that... What I wanna say is, that the Championship helps to make the job Barista be better known. And that's what we need out there. Specially I as a shop owner who has a lot of problems finding a good barista if nobody knows what it is.
Ok, nuff said. This sounds much like advertising, I know. But they don't pay me money to tell you this - I just want the SCAE to be more famous soon, so that guests who enter my place and see the wooden SCAE sign know that here you'll find the best coffee cause the SCAE stands for a certain level of quality. Like restaurants get a better reputation if the Gault Millau has mentioned them...or other certifications....

So nuff said, for me the SCAE is a good thing and I will try to use it for me as often as I can.

Cheers
Joey

PS.: It's not easy to get the certificate for "Barista Level 1" according to the SCAE. The test contains over 50 questions and working on the machine, including me as a teacher changing something on the settings, so that one has to find the failure by himself.... it's not just watching the attendant making one espresso.... and one has to have worked in any coffee business for at least 3 month!!!!! So it's nothing for hobby baristas, it's for professional baristas who want to stand out from the rest. And the SCAE watches over the trainers by asking the attendees if the lessons were satisfying and ckeck the content frequently. I also have to tell them about every training I am doing. So they are very strict and want to prevent people missusing the SCAE logo.
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Postby Steve » Sun May 28, 2006 11:32 am

Sorry the answers are very UK based.

Ok guys some progress. I attended the premier meeting of the SCAE UK chapter committee this week. There was AN AWFUL LOT OF LOVE for TMC during the meeting from some of the trade guys, in fact a scarily amount of love. The trade guys are picking everything we are talking about here up, this forum does make a difference. I also took along a print out from this thread.

Ok moving on, we decided on a few things to raise membership educate and try and get home users as well as trade to get involved. We talked about offering four sessions (yes I know there are 5 we didn’t finalise the program) a year around the country. The ideas thrown about were

1. Roasting Workshop
2. Cupping Workshop
3. Meet the Grower Day
4. Barista Training Day
5. Latte Art Workshop

There would be a charge for the day, which would be heavily discounted for SCAE Members. I’ve been here before where people want a training day but when money gets talked about people back off. What do you think would be an acceptable charge for member and non-members for such days. Do you think this would be enough to get you involved. I think that the hope would be to get volunteers involved to keep the program rolling and growing.

The other thing to keep in mind is that this would give you access to some of the stars of the industry (mercanta, La Spazialle James Hoffman and some ginger bloke form Stafford  )
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Postby Joey » Sun May 28, 2006 12:19 pm

I hope my advertising speech for SCAE still helps to get some more members, even if it's on UK ground :oops: :oops: :oops: I think I missed the subject, but anyway - please join!
:roll:
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Postby Steve » Sun May 28, 2006 12:27 pm

I'm sure it will Joey, hopefull Europe wide, we need some new blood in the industry to sort out this commercial slant of profit over quailty.
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Postby scook94 » Sun May 28, 2006 1:04 pm

As important as the price, the location is also a factor. I would take a guess that London will be the locale of choice. For me that would just about rule it out...
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Postby Steve » Sun May 28, 2006 1:11 pm

No we want to take it on the road so it would be all over. glasgow was mentioned as was manchester, stafford, and london.
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Postby scook94 » Sun May 28, 2006 1:18 pm

Steve wrote:No we want to take it on the road so it would be all over. glasgow was mentioned as was manchester, stafford, and london.


Superb! It's not that I would be against travelling but I would prefer to drive there, Manchester and even Stafford wouldn't be out of the question. Glasgow would be even better! :D
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Postby wallisj » Sun May 28, 2006 11:42 pm

I agree....the biggest hurdle is not necessarily the direct cost but the indirect ones .... travel costs, time etc

I guess the price difference for scae/non scae members would depend on how much the cost of membership is and what you currently get for that outlay or would do in the new way

If you're paying £200 / year for membership for a badge/sticker and a newsletter then you would expect events to be extremely discounted.

Its also dependant on the duration/quality/content/level (target audience) aspects as to the value proposition.

Sorry for being vague
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Postby Steve » Mon May 29, 2006 9:36 am

No I think all of this is important.

I think the sesions are going to be aimed at all day (certainlt the roasting workshop).

Membership is around £90 and for this badge, regular newsletter and some other stuff they send through. Also cheaper to go to the conference and events there should you wish.

I guess you have to look at how much a barista class would cost from the UK champion (sorry Jim but your the easiest to use). Jim is our friend but can also command a high fee for a day’s training. So if you could get this heavily discounted for being a member and that’s great value (if Barista skills float s your boat). But more importantly the more members we get, the bigger the UK chapter becomes the more events happen, the more value for money membership becomes. I see a point where home SCAE users have a day where they set up what happens and who the speakers are, and the professional world turn up and do there piece. I also see a point where we have a barista championship of home users (far better than the Rubbish Gaggia tried to do), organised by volunteers with the help of the UK chapter.

These could be exiting times but there needs to be a ground swell of people wanting to help getting it going.

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Postby kingseven » Mon May 29, 2006 10:24 am

Did that Gaggia Home Barista comp ever happen?
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Postby Steve » Mon May 29, 2006 10:26 am

I dont rememebr but they certainly used the idea to get some PR !
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Postby scook94 » Mon May 29, 2006 11:27 am

Just had a look on the SCAE site, it's about £85 quid to join. This is hard to justify at the moment, but if the member discount for the above workshops went a fair way to offset this price then I'd be more than happy to sign up.
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Postby CakeBoy » Mon May 29, 2006 11:59 am

Steve wrote:Sorry the answers are very UK based.

Ok guys some progress. I attended the premier meeting of the SCAE UK chapter committee this week. There was AN AWFUL LOT OF LOVE for TMC during the meeting from some of the trade guys, in fact a scarily amount of love. The trade guys are picking everything we are talking about here up, this forum does make a difference. I also took along a print out from this thread.

Ok moving on, we decided on a few things to raise membership educate and try and get home users as well as trade to get involved. We talked about offering four sessions (yes I know there are 5 we didn’t finalise the program) a year around the country. The ideas thrown about were

1. Roasting Workshop
2. Cupping Workshop
3. Meet the Grower Day
4. Barista Training Day
5. Latte Art Workshop

There would be a charge for the day, which would be heavily discounted for SCAE Members. I’ve been here before where people want a training day but when money gets talked about people back off. What do you think would be an acceptable charge for member and non-members for such days. Do you think this would be enough to get you involved. I think that the hope would be to get volunteers involved to keep the program rolling and growing.

The other thing to keep in mind is that this would give you access to some of the stars of the industry (mercanta, La Spazialle James Hoffman and some ginger bloke form Stafford  )


If the membership fee and training costs together came out as reasonable value, I think a lot of TMC'ers would be interested. There currently seems to be a bit of a mental block at paying out £85 with no perceived gains above being a part of the group.

Would the training provide some form of recognition that a certain standard has been reached? Quite a few here - well no, actually most here - are already way above industry standard (for baristi in the cafes etc supplied by the industry) both in terms of knowledge and skills, so the training day with Jim and other champions would be to enable a higher plateau to be reached by already very capable baristi. Recognition of Jim's input and the effect that has had on the standard achieved would therefore be very important.
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Postby Steve » Mon May 29, 2006 12:02 pm

ould the training provide some form of recognition that a certain standard has been reached?


Good question Cakey, of which I dont have the answer..... will get back to you.
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