quickmill andreja or izzo alex...?

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quickmill andreja or izzo alex...?

Postby richardd » Thu May 11, 2006 1:04 pm

Hi

I'm a domestic barrista wannabe currently owning a la pavoni. I'm interested in moving up to one of the two machines in the subject.

they seem to have similar characteristics - I wondered if anyone here has any strong opinions (or direct experience) either way? it would mainly be used at weekends, with one or two midweek espressos to keep me awake.

I used to have a gaggia classic before being seduced by the pavoni, but haven't really fallen in love with it. I get ok results, but nothing astonishing yet, and nothing very repeatable either. in many ways I wish I'd kept my old gaggia.

any comments gratefully received.
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Postby Davec » Thu May 11, 2006 1:12 pm

I assume you have read the reviews, so really it boils down to a few questions you need to ask yourself and also interesting that you havn't said QM Andreja or Izzo Vivi!.

1. Is how the machine looks very important to you and do you prefer the look of one machine over another
2. The Alex is a little larger than the Quick Mill. but not much larger....it just doesn't look as compact
3. The quickmill has a few sweet features, like the mag water level and no burn steam wands etc.. some useful, some hype.
4. The Alex has a Rotary pump, the Quickmill a Vibe pump
5. The Alex could easily deal with commercial volumes

The fact that you didnt say a Vivi probably means that you really like the look of the quickmill and are comparing with the Alex but dont like the look of the Alex. because the Vivi would have been a closer comparison.....an MUCH cheaper.

My advice have a quiet think about things for the next 2-3 weeks before you buy or commit to anything!
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Postby Guest » Thu May 11, 2006 2:25 pm

thanks for your comments. initially I became interested in the andreja from reading reviews on another website (an american one if I recall), this lead me to looking for a uk distributor and bellabarista. I suppose I was comparing it with the alex just by price point.

I'm hoping to attend one of their forthcoming workshops and (hopefully) getting some hands on experience. perhaps I should be thinking more about the vivvi - maybe because I've been dissapointed with my recent gaggia->pavoni upgrade I'm doubly keen to make sure that the next machine I buy will just last forever :)
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Postby Chivalry » Thu May 11, 2006 5:25 pm

buy a Vivi :) pretty much identical to the Alex in all ways except it has a vibe pump instead of a rotary.... i looked at both and after all things considerd went for the Vivi...
My main fear on the pump maybe only lasting 5 years where the Rotory would last probably double.. or even 3 times that? were put to rest when the Belle Barista chap informed me the vibe pumps cost around 25 quid and are easily self installed shoul it go wrong... Rotory pumps on the other hand are definatly NOT 25 quid.... and id not look forward to replacing 1.. even every 10 years :)
Cost wise id go so far as to say the vibe pump probably works out cheaper in the long run.. it really comes down to if u feel your getting a noticlbe differnce in Quality of Coffee using a rotory over a vibe,,

anyways.. i bought a vivi.. and cant reccomend it enough... superb build quality and looks stunning (well i like it anyway!!) :)

oh and it makes awesome coffee too.. lol ...
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Postby Davec » Fri May 12, 2006 2:34 pm

Chivalry wrote:buy a Vivi :) pretty much identical to the Alex in all ways except it has a vibe pump instead of a rotary.... i looked at both and after all things considerd went for the Vivi...
My main fear on the pump maybe only lasting 5 years where the Rotory would last probably double.. or even 3 times that? were put to rest when the Belle Barista chap informed me the vibe pumps cost around 25 quid and are easily self installed shoul it go wrong... Rotory pumps on the other hand are definatly NOT 25 quid.... and id not look forward to replacing 1.. even every 10 years :)
Cost wise id go so far as to say the vibe pump probably works out cheaper in the long run.. it really comes down to if u feel your getting a noticlbe differnce in Quality of Coffee using a rotory over a vibe,,

anyways.. i bought a vivi.. and cant reccomend it enough... superb build quality and looks stunning (well i like it anyway!!) :)

oh and it makes awesome coffee too.. lol ...


Although I can't argue with your choice of machine....I think you made a nice choice. For anyone contemplating buying an Alex, please don't let the concern of a Rotary pump replacement and the mistaken belief in its high cost put you off!.

It's a very easy job indeed and it's quite accessible. The cost of a new Rotoflow pump for the Alex is under £40 for their customers and it was one of the questions I had when reviewing! I know this because I ordered a spare....just in case (and it was cheap enough to have hanging around as a just in case part!).

Now i'm not advocating that people should rush out and buy an Alex or any other machine....but best to know the facts. I have a machine coming to review next week.....so mabye I will be selling the Alex.....only kidding about selling the Alex.....well mabye...it will be a tough one :roll: mabye I can have two machines......hang on I hear the wife shouting at me :wink:
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Postby GeorgeW » Fri May 12, 2006 3:07 pm

Davec wrote:
Chivalry wrote:buy a Vivi :) pretty much identical to the Alex in all ways except it has a vibe pump instead of a rotary.... i looked at both and after all things considerd went for the Vivi...
My main fear on the pump maybe only lasting 5 years where the Rotory would last probably double.. or even 3 times that? were put to rest when the Belle Barista chap informed me the vibe pumps cost around 25 quid and are easily self installed shoul it go wrong... Rotory pumps on the other hand are definatly NOT 25 quid.... and id not look forward to replacing 1.. even every 10 years :)
Cost wise id go so far as to say the vibe pump probably works out cheaper in the long run.. it really comes down to if u feel your getting a noticlbe differnce in Quality of Coffee using a rotory over a vibe,,

anyways.. i bought a vivi.. and cant reccomend it enough... superb build quality and looks stunning (well i like it anyway!!) :)

oh and it makes awesome coffee too.. lol ...


Although I can't argue with your choice of machine....I think you made a nice choice. For anyone contemplating buying an Alex, please don't let the concern of a Rotary pump replacement and the mistaken belief in its high cost put you off!.

It's a very easy job indeed and it's quite accessible. The cost of a new Rotoflow pump for the Alex is under £40 for their customers and it was one of the questions I had when reviewing! I know this because I ordered a spare....just in case (and it was cheap enough to have hanging around as a just in case part!).

Now i'm not advocating that people should rush out and buy an Alex or any other machine....but best to know the facts. I have a machine coming to review next week.....so mabye I will be selling the Alex.....only kidding about selling the Alex.....well mabye...it will be a tough one :roll: mabye I can have two machines......hang on I hear the wife shouting at me :wink:


I know it would be hard Dave but it really may be for the best to sell the Alex...well maybe not sell but to give it away..after all selling is so impersonal and you never know who may get it, do you?
The more I think about it the more I'm convinced that this would be the right course to take if you want to feel all lovely and fuzzy inside.
Just think about it, no more marital discord and the warm feeling that you have made someone (probably someone you respect and admire) very happy. :roll:
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Postby Chivalry » Fri May 12, 2006 4:31 pm

?? i already have an izzo.....where would i put his alex ?? :0)
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Postby Davec » Fri May 12, 2006 5:43 pm

When I have to carry my Alex fgrom one place to another I wish I had a Vivi, if I have to put it in the car, I wish I had a Silvia.....when I go on holiday...i wish I could have had a decent coffee :roll:
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Postby Guest » Fri May 12, 2006 7:58 pm

an alex able to cope with commercial demand, are you out of your mind?
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Postby RobC » Fri May 12, 2006 9:15 pm

I hope not, there is only room for one lunatic on this forum and I fill that gap (missus) admirably. Anyway, I am not mad, just a bit unbalanced. Bark.

Depends on you classification of commercial demand, the hand filled aspect would be a bind, but a 1 group machine even like the Alex could deal with a great deal of light commercial use, providing it was for traditional italian COFFEE (ie 7floz cappuccino cups with equal thirds coffee, steamed milk, foamed milk) not 12floz mugs of tea and 16oz *$ hot milk with a hint of coffee flavouring.

As for pumps, I would find it hard to descern the taste difference between vibe pump and rotary. If you have the option of plumbing in then there is a wealth of choice in the Rotary bracket, but if you have to have a hand filled machine Rotary is limited. The big difference between the two as I see it is that the Vibe pump machines are regulated at 9 bar brew pressure - and in most cases adjusting the brew pressure is not an option. Rotary pumps all have an adjuster on them (although the Flowtec head is harder then the Procon version to adjust) - so you can set your brew pressure at whatever you desire (should you be that way inclined).

Having seen the Alex (I know what it is called now) in action last weekend, I was most impressed with the build quality and also the shots WallisJ was pulling from it. It would get my vote but I have yet to get hold of a Quickmill AP.

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Postby Davec » Fri May 12, 2006 9:16 pm

Anonymous wrote:an alex able to cope with commercial demand, are you out of your mind?


I don't believe so....if you had the volumes that would be serviced by a single group machine (small cafe, or resteraunt)....an Alex would easily be up to the task. You would have to hand fill it, unless you went in for a plumbed option (which is available). Recovery time between shots is pretty much instant, steam is powerful and long lasting. The pressure in fact is considerably reduced for domestic use, but would probably not need to be much higher for commercial use. The only think that would be a good idea should volumes be high is to draw the hot water from a separate hot water boiler (Burco, but to be honest in many cases thats preferable).

The machine was actually designed as a small commercial 1 group (see the manufacturers web site). However your perspective is appreciated and I am sure when you join TMC you will be able to shed more light on this and share your experience with us. :)
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Postby Guest » Sat May 13, 2006 4:30 pm

sorry no I meant it as two seperate questions, first question was is it able to cope with commercial situations and the second question was are you out of your mind?

I take it you have used this machine in a commercial situation then, you must be a coffee shop owner? or have you just made a couple of shots at home and the decided it would work in a coffee shop ?
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Postby RobC » Sat May 13, 2006 6:00 pm

Anonymous wrote:sorry no I meant it as two seperate questions, first question was is it able to cope with commercial situations and the second question was are you out of your mind?

I take it you have used this machine in a commercial situation then, you must be a coffee shop owner? or have you just made a couple of shots at home and the decided it would work in a coffee shop ?
LOL, with these questions Guest you are spoiling us. :twisted:
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Postby Guest » Sat May 13, 2006 7:49 pm

why thankyou RobC I am pleased to be a part of the community, are you and DaveC brothers?
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Postby Bertie_Doe » Sat May 13, 2006 8:08 pm

Guest wrote
then, you must be a coffee shop owner? or have you just made a couple of shots at home and the decided it would work in a coffee shop ?

The Company's site suggested small (light?) commercial use http://www.gruppoizzo.it/home.php?sez=7
For a busy cafe or coffee bar, I think maybe a 2group machine, with a larger boiler, might be more suitable.
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